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	<title>Comments on: Sermon: Seeing is Believing, John 20:19-31</title>
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	<link>http://www.adamjcopeland.com/2008/03/30/sermon-seeing-is-believing-john-2019-31/</link>
	<description>Adam J. Copeland</description>
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		<title>By: Sam</title>
		<link>http://www.adamjcopeland.com/2008/03/30/sermon-seeing-is-believing-john-2019-31/comment-page-1/#comment-767</link>
		<dc:creator>Sam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Apr 2010 20:24:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://adamcopeland.wordpress.com/?p=190#comment-767</guid>
		<description>OUTSTANDING thank you!  I&#039;m so tired of folks beating up on Thomas.  People think they understand what&#039;s in the bible without actually reading it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OUTSTANDING thank you!  I&#8217;m so tired of folks beating up on Thomas.  People think they understand what&#8217;s in the bible without actually reading it.</p>
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		<title>By: adamjcopeland</title>
		<link>http://www.adamjcopeland.com/2008/03/30/sermon-seeing-is-believing-john-2019-31/comment-page-1/#comment-766</link>
		<dc:creator>adamjcopeland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Apr 2009 02:01:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://adamcopeland.wordpress.com/?p=190#comment-766</guid>
		<description>Hey Steve, glad you found me.  I don&#039;t have any current thoughts on a children&#039;s sermons re this text, but here&#039;s an old post that may give you a place to begin ;)
http://adamjcopeland.com/2008/04/07/great-childrens-sermon-resource/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Steve, glad you found me.  I don&#8217;t have any current thoughts on a children&#8217;s sermons re this text, but here&#8217;s an old post that may give you a place to begin <img src='http://www.adamjcopeland.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /><br />
<a href="http://adamjcopeland.com/2008/04/07/great-childrens-sermon-resource/" rel="nofollow">http://adamjcopeland.com/2008/04/07/great-childrens-sermon-resource/</a></p>
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		<title>By: Steve Calkins</title>
		<link>http://www.adamjcopeland.com/2008/03/30/sermon-seeing-is-believing-john-2019-31/comment-page-1/#comment-765</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Calkins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Apr 2009 16:49:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://adamcopeland.wordpress.com/?p=190#comment-765</guid>
		<description>Very interesting and thoughtful.  So I can&#039;t help but ask for additional help.  I need to do a 5 minute children&#039;s sermon, to kids grades 1-5 but in front of the congregation, on the upcoming assistant minister Sunday.

Suggestions would be much appreciated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very interesting and thoughtful.  So I can&#8217;t help but ask for additional help.  I need to do a 5 minute children&#8217;s sermon, to kids grades 1-5 but in front of the congregation, on the upcoming assistant minister Sunday.</p>
<p>Suggestions would be much appreciated.</p>
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		<title>By: Adam Copeland</title>
		<link>http://www.adamjcopeland.com/2008/03/30/sermon-seeing-is-believing-john-2019-31/comment-page-1/#comment-764</link>
		<dc:creator>Adam Copeland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Jun 2008 11:04:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://adamcopeland.wordpress.com/?p=190#comment-764</guid>
		<description>Thanks, Dr. Flink.  I&#039;m a big advocate of the idea that preaching is not a one time event, but a conservation with a congregation over a long period of time.  So certainly, one sermon can only do a wee bit.  Over time, thanks to Holy Spirit and the conversations of members--often on all the points the sermon missed--great things can happen.  Thanks for the word.  AJC</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, Dr. Flink.  I&#8217;m a big advocate of the idea that preaching is not a one time event, but a conservation with a congregation over a long period of time.  So certainly, one sermon can only do a wee bit.  Over time, thanks to Holy Spirit and the conversations of members&#8211;often on all the points the sermon missed&#8211;great things can happen.  Thanks for the word.  AJC</p>
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		<title>By: Fred Flink</title>
		<link>http://www.adamjcopeland.com/2008/03/30/sermon-seeing-is-believing-john-2019-31/comment-page-1/#comment-763</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred Flink</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Jun 2008 22:39:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://adamcopeland.wordpress.com/?p=190#comment-763</guid>
		<description>Adam,

This is getting to you somewhat after the fact, and I don&#039;t even know if you&#039;ll read it, but I wanted to let you know that I enjoy reading your sermons. They are not too ponderous and not too light.  Pretty much, they are just right.

When you&#039;re a young minister&#039;s assistant, you only have one chance to get your sermon right, unlike a novelist who has months to have his work read and edited and reworked, or a stand-up comic who can hone his routine after many trials.

All in all, you are doing a great job considering the restraints under which you work. Thank you for posting your sermons, and thanks to the Holy Spirit for helping you in their preparation.

Fred Flink</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Adam,</p>
<p>This is getting to you somewhat after the fact, and I don&#8217;t even know if you&#8217;ll read it, but I wanted to let you know that I enjoy reading your sermons. They are not too ponderous and not too light.  Pretty much, they are just right.</p>
<p>When you&#8217;re a young minister&#8217;s assistant, you only have one chance to get your sermon right, unlike a novelist who has months to have his work read and edited and reworked, or a stand-up comic who can hone his routine after many trials.</p>
<p>All in all, you are doing a great job considering the restraints under which you work. Thank you for posting your sermons, and thanks to the Holy Spirit for helping you in their preparation.</p>
<p>Fred Flink</p>
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		<title>By: David Campton</title>
		<link>http://www.adamjcopeland.com/2008/03/30/sermon-seeing-is-believing-john-2019-31/comment-page-1/#comment-762</link>
		<dc:creator>David Campton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Mar 2008 15:52:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://adamcopeland.wordpress.com/?p=190#comment-762</guid>
		<description>Hi there... as somone who was a beneficiary of international Assistant Minister Sunday, enjoying a few post easter days with my Mother in law in Prestwick, while someone else was in my pulpit back in Belfast, I wish I had latched on to your blog before we came home. I would very much have liked to come listen to you and share in worship at St Columba&#039;s.
You are a brave man posting your sermons for others to dissect... Even after all my years of preaching I wouldn&#039;t be so bold... Actually, most of my sermons are so contextual now that they do not translate easily to the general (at least that is one of my excuses).
Without wanting to heavily critique your sermon (which I enjoyed... as I have enjoyed most of your previous stuff having spent an inordinate amount of time this afternoon reading it), whilst you distinguish seeing Jesus in the Bible and in the church, in many ways we only fully see Jesus in the Bible when the when we are collectively and contextually seeking him there... The solo pursuit all too often becomes the &quot;looking down at a reflection in a deep well&quot; that Schweitzer criticised the 19th century quest for the historical Jesus... The collective approach, opens up a range of perspectives denied to any individual, whilst the &quot;tradition&quot; in which any collective stands should serve to prevent the contextualisation of scripture getting out of hand...
In addition we need to open our eyes to see Jesus in those outside the church (Matt 25)... putting our fingers in the open wounds of the contemporary world.
But thank you... I will be popping back from time to time...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi there&#8230; as somone who was a beneficiary of international Assistant Minister Sunday, enjoying a few post easter days with my Mother in law in Prestwick, while someone else was in my pulpit back in Belfast, I wish I had latched on to your blog before we came home. I would very much have liked to come listen to you and share in worship at St Columba&#8217;s.<br />
You are a brave man posting your sermons for others to dissect&#8230; Even after all my years of preaching I wouldn&#8217;t be so bold&#8230; Actually, most of my sermons are so contextual now that they do not translate easily to the general (at least that is one of my excuses).<br />
Without wanting to heavily critique your sermon (which I enjoyed&#8230; as I have enjoyed most of your previous stuff having spent an inordinate amount of time this afternoon reading it), whilst you distinguish seeing Jesus in the Bible and in the church, in many ways we only fully see Jesus in the Bible when the when we are collectively and contextually seeking him there&#8230; The solo pursuit all too often becomes the &#8220;looking down at a reflection in a deep well&#8221; that Schweitzer criticised the 19th century quest for the historical Jesus&#8230; The collective approach, opens up a range of perspectives denied to any individual, whilst the &#8220;tradition&#8221; in which any collective stands should serve to prevent the contextualisation of scripture getting out of hand&#8230;<br />
In addition we need to open our eyes to see Jesus in those outside the church (Matt 25)&#8230; putting our fingers in the open wounds of the contemporary world.<br />
But thank you&#8230; I will be popping back from time to time&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: adamjcopeland</title>
		<link>http://www.adamjcopeland.com/2008/03/30/sermon-seeing-is-believing-john-2019-31/comment-page-1/#comment-761</link>
		<dc:creator>adamjcopeland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Mar 2008 08:26:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://adamcopeland.wordpress.com/?p=190#comment-761</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the comments, Mr/s Guest.  To be consistent with my (only briefly) published comment policy, please leave at least initials and an email address in future comments (the email address won&#039;t go public).

I take several of your points to heart, and agree with most of them.  The sermon could certainly be improved.  And if I was preaching in the states, to a congregation with whom I would have a long relationship, I would go further.  Let&#039;s take the bible reading point, for instance.

You write, &quot;how many people, who before today would not, will read the bible because you said you will find jesus there?&quot;  Fantastic question.  First, I think a preacher should be careful not to think she has too much pull.  Will one sermon drastically change someone&#039;s daily habits?  Probably not.  If a preacher, on the other hand, in each sermon shows how reading the Bible can be fun, exciting, and take folks to new places in their faith, then I think we can get somewhere.  I&#039;m aware that I&#039;m out of here in 3 months.  I can push, &quot;Read your Bible&quot; over and over again, but if there&#039;s not support, structures, and a community ethic to do so then I doubt much will change.  In this context, many folk are so intimidated by their Bibles (for reasons I can&#039;t go into in such a forum) that they need a year of demonstration that the Bible is not scary before they will pull out their dusty youth fellowship Bible from years past.  I&#039;m aware I&#039;m pushing small small steps, but I&#039;m trying to do so at every event at which I speak, and model careful Bible reading often.  Several people have mentioned to me, &quot;You sure do talk about the Bible a lot&quot; which I take as movement in the right direction--they&#039;re noticing, and it&#039;s being reinforced.

Regarding another point of yours, &quot;it doesnt feel like there adequate attention was given to the intersection between the jesus of the bible and the lives of the people to whom you have preached.&quot; Again, I hear you, and I agree.  I went 16.5 minutes--long for this context--and there were several other places I would have gone if the congregation was used to longer sermons.  However, right after my sermon we sang the hymn I quoted and it summed things up like I&#039;ve never felt before.  It was awesome: the energy from the sermon peaked during the hymn, which in a few verses said what I had taken so long to say.  Great holy spirit stuff.

Not sure about this, but the section on seeing Jesus in community, particularly the intergenerational community of the church was actually mean to push a bit.  In two other church forums recently I&#039;ve suggested ways in which they could move towards more intentional community.  So in that section I tried to both affirm, and to those few hundred who attended the other forums, renew thoughts of how we can do that better.

Many thanks for your comments.  Cheers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the comments, Mr/s Guest.  To be consistent with my (only briefly) published comment policy, please leave at least initials and an email address in future comments (the email address won&#8217;t go public).</p>
<p>I take several of your points to heart, and agree with most of them.  The sermon could certainly be improved.  And if I was preaching in the states, to a congregation with whom I would have a long relationship, I would go further.  Let&#8217;s take the bible reading point, for instance.</p>
<p>You write, &#8220;how many people, who before today would not, will read the bible because you said you will find jesus there?&#8221;  Fantastic question.  First, I think a preacher should be careful not to think she has too much pull.  Will one sermon drastically change someone&#8217;s daily habits?  Probably not.  If a preacher, on the other hand, in each sermon shows how reading the Bible can be fun, exciting, and take folks to new places in their faith, then I think we can get somewhere.  I&#8217;m aware that I&#8217;m out of here in 3 months.  I can push, &#8220;Read your Bible&#8221; over and over again, but if there&#8217;s not support, structures, and a community ethic to do so then I doubt much will change.  In this context, many folk are so intimidated by their Bibles (for reasons I can&#8217;t go into in such a forum) that they need a year of demonstration that the Bible is not scary before they will pull out their dusty youth fellowship Bible from years past.  I&#8217;m aware I&#8217;m pushing small small steps, but I&#8217;m trying to do so at every event at which I speak, and model careful Bible reading often.  Several people have mentioned to me, &#8220;You sure do talk about the Bible a lot&#8221; which I take as movement in the right direction&#8211;they&#8217;re noticing, and it&#8217;s being reinforced.</p>
<p>Regarding another point of yours, &#8220;it doesnt feel like there adequate attention was given to the intersection between the jesus of the bible and the lives of the people to whom you have preached.&#8221; Again, I hear you, and I agree.  I went 16.5 minutes&#8211;long for this context&#8211;and there were several other places I would have gone if the congregation was used to longer sermons.  However, right after my sermon we sang the hymn I quoted and it summed things up like I&#8217;ve never felt before.  It was awesome: the energy from the sermon peaked during the hymn, which in a few verses said what I had taken so long to say.  Great holy spirit stuff.</p>
<p>Not sure about this, but the section on seeing Jesus in community, particularly the intergenerational community of the church was actually mean to push a bit.  In two other church forums recently I&#8217;ve suggested ways in which they could move towards more intentional community.  So in that section I tried to both affirm, and to those few hundred who attended the other forums, renew thoughts of how we can do that better.</p>
<p>Many thanks for your comments.  Cheers.</p>
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		<title>By: guest</title>
		<link>http://www.adamjcopeland.com/2008/03/30/sermon-seeing-is-believing-john-2019-31/comment-page-1/#comment-760</link>
		<dc:creator>guest</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Mar 2008 21:00:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://adamcopeland.wordpress.com/?p=190#comment-760</guid>
		<description>as usual the middle section of your sermon is your best.  it seems to trail off when you ask the question where do we see jesus.

how many people, who before today would not, will read the bible because you said you will find jesus there?  it reads more closely to guthrie&#039;s christian doctrine than pulpit proclamation.

the fundamental issue is why believe without seeing?  the words and stories about jesus in the bible are a theological student&#039;s answer to where jesus is today, but does that speak as clearly to your average church member?   it doesnt feel like there adequate attention was given to the intersection between the jesus of the bible and the lives of the people to whom you have preached.

one preacher asked a great preacher how to organize and write a sermon.  his answer was, &quot;you want to learn the art of constructing themata...in my view there&#039;s nothing more foolish than to sit down and try to come up with a theme. for that you must arrange your life sensibly. see to it that every day you have at least half an hour for incidental reading in the new testament, or a devotional work. when you go for a walk you must let your thoughts flutter randomly, sniffing here and there, letting them have a go now here, now there. that is how to arrange one&#039;s housekeeping. themata are the accidents that the week should deliver to you in abundance. but the more you see to it that the dividends are uncertain, the freer, better, richer they will become, and the more striking, surprising, penetrating.&quot;

the purpose of preaching, one of them at least, is to get people to see that they do not believe without seeing.  the preacher&#039;s task is to open the eyes of the believer or point them to the truth that god is alive today.  the difficult task for a preacher who spends much time in the study is finding theological intersection in congregants&#039; lives.  that is, of showing them that ordinary events are theological.  these events are communicated to congregations through stories told in the listeners&#039; language.

that said, you are a very good writer and your sermons display wisdom and passion, which is a rare combination in the church.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>as usual the middle section of your sermon is your best.  it seems to trail off when you ask the question where do we see jesus.</p>
<p>how many people, who before today would not, will read the bible because you said you will find jesus there?  it reads more closely to guthrie&#8217;s christian doctrine than pulpit proclamation.</p>
<p>the fundamental issue is why believe without seeing?  the words and stories about jesus in the bible are a theological student&#8217;s answer to where jesus is today, but does that speak as clearly to your average church member?   it doesnt feel like there adequate attention was given to the intersection between the jesus of the bible and the lives of the people to whom you have preached.</p>
<p>one preacher asked a great preacher how to organize and write a sermon.  his answer was, &#8220;you want to learn the art of constructing themata&#8230;in my view there&#8217;s nothing more foolish than to sit down and try to come up with a theme. for that you must arrange your life sensibly. see to it that every day you have at least half an hour for incidental reading in the new testament, or a devotional work. when you go for a walk you must let your thoughts flutter randomly, sniffing here and there, letting them have a go now here, now there. that is how to arrange one&#8217;s housekeeping. themata are the accidents that the week should deliver to you in abundance. but the more you see to it that the dividends are uncertain, the freer, better, richer they will become, and the more striking, surprising, penetrating.&#8221;</p>
<p>the purpose of preaching, one of them at least, is to get people to see that they do not believe without seeing.  the preacher&#8217;s task is to open the eyes of the believer or point them to the truth that god is alive today.  the difficult task for a preacher who spends much time in the study is finding theological intersection in congregants&#8217; lives.  that is, of showing them that ordinary events are theological.  these events are communicated to congregations through stories told in the listeners&#8217; language.</p>
<p>that said, you are a very good writer and your sermons display wisdom and passion, which is a rare combination in the church.</p>
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		<title>By: Danny</title>
		<link>http://www.adamjcopeland.com/2008/03/30/sermon-seeing-is-believing-john-2019-31/comment-page-1/#comment-759</link>
		<dc:creator>Danny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Mar 2008 14:39:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://adamcopeland.wordpress.com/?p=190#comment-759</guid>
		<description>Yup it was International Assistant Minister&#039;s day in Kilmarnock too... and this assistant is more than ready for a holiday!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yup it was International Assistant Minister&#8217;s day in Kilmarnock too&#8230; and this assistant is more than ready for a holiday!</p>
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