Comments on: Starfish or Spider Church? Part I http://www.adamjcopeland.com/2009/03/02/spider-or-starfish-church-part-i/ Adam J. Copeland Sat, 04 Sep 2010 14:19:50 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.1 By: joan calvin http://www.adamjcopeland.com/2009/03/02/spider-or-starfish-church-part-i/comment-page-1/#comment-1506 joan calvin Wed, 04 Mar 2009 14:57:47 +0000 http://adamjcopeland.com/?p=891#comment-1506 Oh, I understand. My point was just that their analogy was bad; not that the idea is bad. Starfish have no brains in their legs. So, if they are analogizing to something with brains spread out, they just picked the wrong animal. (Actually I can't think of an appropriate animal.) I'm just picking nits ;-) Oh, I understand. My point was just that their analogy was bad; not that the idea is bad. Starfish have no brains in their legs. So, if they are analogizing to something with brains spread out, they just picked the wrong animal. (Actually I can’t think of an appropriate animal.) I’m just picking nits ;-)

]]> By: adamjcopeland http://www.adamjcopeland.com/2009/03/02/spider-or-starfish-church-part-i/comment-page-1/#comment-1505 adamjcopeland Tue, 03 Mar 2009 13:59:28 +0000 http://adamjcopeland.com/?p=891#comment-1505 Thanks, Joan. I think they’d say you’re actually identifying spider issues not starfish ones. The authors would argue that it’s not that starfish orgs have no brain, but that their brains are spread out in many different areas. The curious part is that the ideas can come from any leg, not just the top. They argue that this makes starfish orgs move much more quickly and adapt more easily because their legs have different the folks/skills rather than just specialized ones. Think of a special ops team for the army -- not their example, but it works. A good team is made up of folks w/ different skills rather than all gunners or radio folks or whatever. That way they can adapt quickly, because many skills are present. All that said, they do explain the importance of “catalysts” -- maybe that brain drive you’re searching for. Not every org needs a catalyst, and catalysts aren’t necessarily good leaders, but they can help get things off the ground. Got to run. More later. Oh, btw, that's hilarious, David. Thanks, Joan. I think they’d say you’re actually identifying spider issues not starfish ones. The authors would argue that it’s not that starfish orgs have no brain, but that their brains are spread out in many different areas. The curious part is that the ideas can come from any leg, not just the top. They argue that this makes starfish orgs move much more quickly and adapt more easily because their legs have different the folks/skills rather than just specialized ones.

Think of a special ops team for the army — not their example, but it works. A good team is made up of folks w/ different skills rather than all gunners or radio folks or whatever. That way they can adapt quickly, because many skills are present.

All that said, they do explain the importance of “catalysts” — maybe that brain drive you’re searching for. Not every org needs a catalyst, and catalysts aren’t necessarily good leaders, but they can help get things off the ground.

Got to run. More later.

Oh, btw, that’s hilarious, David.

]]> By: Joan Calvin http://www.adamjcopeland.com/2009/03/02/spider-or-starfish-church-part-i/comment-page-1/#comment-1504 Joan Calvin Tue, 03 Mar 2009 13:19:54 +0000 http://adamjcopeland.com/?p=891#comment-1504 Haven't read the book, but it seems to me they are missing a huge problem in their analogy. In the world, starfish have no brain. They cannot move quickly to adjust to changing conditions. They live if they are cut apart, but all they do is eat and reproduce. Not much inspiring there. Animals with a brain and a hierarchial organization can more easily adjust. Let's take just one example: human beings. No we cannot survive if our heads are cut off (star fish don't have heads), but if we lose our legs, we can make prosthetic legs. Just a thought. Looking forward to Part II. Haven’t read the book, but it seems to me they are missing a huge problem in their analogy. In the world, starfish have no brain. They cannot move quickly to adjust to changing conditions. They live if they are cut apart, but all they do is eat and reproduce. Not much inspiring there. Animals with a brain and a hierarchial organization can more easily adjust. Let’s take just one example: human beings. No we cannot survive if our heads are cut off (star fish don’t have heads), but if we lose our legs, we can make prosthetic legs. Just a thought. Looking forward to Part II.

]]> By: David Williams http://www.adamjcopeland.com/2009/03/02/spider-or-starfish-church-part-i/comment-page-1/#comment-1503 David Williams Mon, 02 Mar 2009 15:06:37 +0000 http://adamjcopeland.com/?p=891#comment-1503 I tend to think they should have said "starfish" vs. "little cuddly bunny." I mean, why use an arachnid that gives conniptions to phobics for your organizational metaphor when you can have a widdle cuddly bunny instead? All the same principles apply. I tend to think they should have said “starfish” vs. “little cuddly bunny.” I mean, why use an arachnid that gives conniptions to phobics for your organizational metaphor when you can have a widdle cuddly bunny instead? All the same principles apply.

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