Comments on: Sermon: Our Holy Song, Psalm 22, Job 23

By: Daily Links – 10.12.09 | Community of the Risen

Daily Links – 10.12.09 | Community of the Risen — Fri, 13 Nov 2009 22:59:35 +0000

[...] Our Holy Song In this sermon, Adam Copeland shares some of his reservations with the song “What a Friend We Have in Jesus,” and talks about being honest with God in prayer. A must-read for those looking for deep theological thoughts on prayer and the Holy Song. [...]

By: Danny Kam

Danny Kam — Tue, 13 Oct 2009 16:40:17 +0000

Sorry that should have said Dennis, not Adam.

By: Danny Kam

Danny Kam — Tue, 13 Oct 2009 16:39:47 +0000

Hi Adam,
I usually work nights at In-N-Out Burger in California (seeing as there are no teaching jobs in CA this year), and I substitute teach (if they call me) during the day. However, they don’t call me that often, so I often spend my nights reading blogs and working on ohter stuff and just sleep in.

By: DennisS

DennisS — Tue, 13 Oct 2009 09:54:48 +0000

Where in the world are you Danny? S. Korea? Or are you just a night owl also?

By: Danny Kam

Danny Kam — Tue, 13 Oct 2009 09:17:51 +0000

Hey Dennis,
I was thinking the EXACT same thing. They just don’t write songs like “What a friend We Have in Jesus” anymore. I think the language is a bit confusing to twenty-somethings like me. What you have said about communal worship is so important, and I’m glad we agree on that.

By: DennisS

DennisS — Tue, 13 Oct 2009 09:06:24 +0000

I wonder if there might be a generational difference in how we understand, and even how we sing, certain hymns. I’m guessing the 50 and over crowd (the majority in most mainline congregations) have no problems with the theology of What a Friend…

What a Friend is written in first person plural–”We”. I don’t read it, nor sing it, as though this is my individual song.

There are quite a few first person songs out there though. Just pick up a songbook and see what percentage of songs begin with “I”, I’ll, I’m, I’ve, Lord, I…, Here I Am…, My, Be Thou My…, etc.

More and more are becoming aware of this. It’s becoming a problem for the theology in the pews/seats. Add all the songs where the lyrics are about “my” Jesus to the thinking about a “personal” Jesus which gets misunderstood, and you end up with people who think Worship is an individual thing–just between them and Jesus. I can actually point you to someone who believes this and keeps bringing it up on the blog of another PCUSA pastor.

Sure, we can praise God as individuals. Maybe we can worship God as individuals. But it appears to me that worship, as exemplified in the Bible, is intended to be communal. An army of one doesn’t make any sense–unless it is speaking of many, or at least several, coming together as one.

By: Danny Kam

Danny Kam — Tue, 13 Oct 2009 05:27:04 +0000

That’s a really good point, Dennis. Lots of people interpret songs differently.

My biggest beef with the song is that it seems like it’s just “me and Jesus.” It reminds of that late 90s hit by Will Smith “Just the two of Us.” It seems to forget that there is a larger church in which we must also live. I’m not saying the song intentionally does this, I just tend to put this song in the same category as Johnny Cash’s “My Own Personal Jesus.” Here’s some of that song:

Your own, personal, Jesus
someone to hear your prayers,
someone who cares

Your own, personal, Jesus
someone to hear your prayers,
someone who’s there

Feeling unknown
and you’re all alone,
flesh and bone,
by the telephone,
lift up the receiver,
i’ll make you a believer

I just find the individualism of the two songs too much for what should be a community “doing life” together.

I think there can be some value in thinking of Jesus as a friend as well, but I just think the song does it at the expense of the church.

But that’s just my two cents.

By: DennisS

DennisS — Tue, 13 Oct 2009 02:48:45 +0000

We all have songs and hymns that we don’t agree with 100%. “I Want Jesus To Walk With Me” – this bothers me because it seems like we want a genie Jesus to take care of all our difficulties, and not a Jesus who is our Master and who instructs us as to his will. Others don’t look at it in this way, and have no problem with the theology of the hymn.

What a Friend We Have in Jesus. It seems to me that the hymn lyrics have us picture ourselves in the arms of the Lord, that when we pray we are present with the Lord, directly speaking to him about the matters upon our hearts. This sure reminds me of the closeness of our Lord. And this is quite a comfort to many. It’s a song of prayer, but more importantly it is a song of hope and trust. And don’t discount the effect of telling someone else all about our troubles–to be unburdened of our heavy loads.

What a Friend We Have in Jesus. I find the lyrics to be a very good exposition of what our powerful Lord, Savior, and Friend said, “Come to me, all you that are weary and are carrying heavy burdens, and I will give you rest.”

By: Danny Kam

Danny Kam — Mon, 12 Oct 2009 22:54:49 +0000

I have always kinda felt the same way about that hymn. The hymn tries to make everything too black and white. Thanks for posting the sermon. I enjoy reading sermon’s from other churches than my own to see what is being talked about in America today.

By: adamjcopeland

adamjcopeland — Mon, 12 Oct 2009 13:03:42 +0000

Right, DennisS. And sorry I didn’t footnote the hymn (can’t figure out footnotes on wordpress, actually, so I just use brackets). I figured it was common enough for all to know … which I think means it definitely would be an easy choice for the next hymnal.

According to http://www.hymnary.org/text/what_a_friend_we_have_in_jesus the text is by Joseph Scriven “(b. Seapatrick, County Down, Ireland, 1819; d. Bewdley, Rice Lake, ON, Canada, 1886), an Irish immigrant to Canada, wrote this text near Port Hope, Ontario, in 1855. Because his life was filled with grief and trials, Scriven often needed the solace of the Lord as described in his famous hymn.”